Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

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multilis
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#16 Post by multilis »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXTjdm4N9tY video showing true form of Mrs. Nibbly ;P

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#17 Post by Zaigan »

Warrl wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 1:20 am
All those are things that could be resolved in an epilogue or left unresolved, or COULD be worked into a major subplot. Well, I'll be surprised if we see Carver again in THIS comic - maybe in a sequel - because the main group is unlikely to go back to Basidian Island and it'll take too long for Carver to work his way back to the mainland. BUT... even that is not impossible (but he'd show up again as a minor villain in a new caper; everything he WAS directly involved in is resolved).
Nibs' identity could be revealed at the end of this chapter, or a conclusion.
Same: resolve in-story, resolve in epilogue, or leave unresolved, all work.
I mean, I think we're kind of on the same page, then. Saying that this seems like the climax, or the first half of it, the highest point of drama in the story before we start resolving everything. Even if the final journey to Lyn'Knoll is a minor story, they are physically very close, so they are unlikely to go do major globe trotting again.

I guess it depends if the main story is something Tom would want to end. It's the sort of thing that feels like it should reach a conclusion, but it's been a part of his life for so long, and it is his job. The idea of a follow up story would make a lot of sense, to sort of follow up on various threads, maybe even have a continuation that's more like slice of life, which has always been an element of the story.

He could have other plans, but a lot of this seems like a perfectly reasonable set up for a Climax, finally bringing in Clovis, having Trace have to face his past and its sins, right all those wrongs and crimes against nature, and then you have the Templar involved in it, too. It could follow it up and then most of the remaining plot points would be lower stakes and winding down.

Saving Adira is about the only real wrench I see in this, although she might have just been kidnapped by Clovis, since I think that they said the wolves used to use that gateway, and it could explain how they got there. Adira is the only plot point I see going far a field.

I only just started thinking about them never reaching Lyn'Knoll and investing in the community here because times are changing, and it could be fostered into a good blend of Human and Keidran culture, which is what Lyn'Knoll was kinda rumored to be. Maybe it's the place we found in ourselves during the journey and the friends we made along the way. Or not. But hey, then Mike and Evals can maybe find a place too, that will meet both their tastes. Maybe if there was just a romantic partner for Evals to settle with and just sometimes visiting his old home.

Or like, I guess his gender bending heterolife partner could be enough as long as it was in a place where Keidren were respected.
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#18 Post by Cinnibar »

Eldritch horror, or dragon....

Here's a thought. Nibs might be able to use that mana she got off Remus, on purpose or not. And did something with that rage and pain and determination. Poor Remus.

A very special squirrel is Nibs. :squirrel:

Actually, that might explain Nib's survival back at the fight with Carver, if being held by the magical Raine :raine: just in time and she can use that magic aura. She's familiar-material.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#19 Post by Titanium Dragon »

Well, we still don't know what she actually is, but she's definitely made of sterner stuff. Not too surprising given the previous treatment she's survived.

It is interesting that he kept avoiding showing us what was going on, but I'm sure it will end up being a plot point later.

As for the people speculating about the end of the strip - they've been heading to that village for the entire story, but there's no way that they're going to go there and things will work out.

They either aren't going to go there because they need to deal with something else, or they're going to go there and the place will be attacked, kicking off another arc where everyone has to deal with the Templar and Keidran and other things that are going on.

We're nowhere near the end, especially at the rate that the story gets posted.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#20 Post by Spazoid »

Well....now we see exactly how Nibs got her rug...
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#21 Post by steelabjur »

Zaigan wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:20 pm Well, we didn't reveal the spooky nature of Nibs completely quite yet. Nice that it really is his own carelessness and pushing matters that killed him in the end. He was spooked by her, but lumbering over the damaged railing was his own fault, and well, Clovis's, that first fireball was Clovis, if I remember, though he told Remus not to pursue Sythe.

I still think it would be funny if Nibs was Nibbler from Futurama, but accept that verges into dumb territory.

Really surprised these pages were posted so close together. Kind of thought there would be another week between them, although Saturdays is the usual update day.

I don't think she's a dragon, though. It was suggested before to elude to her unnatural reality, and played up in an April Fool's gag, but that latter part makes me think it was done to reinforce that whatever supernatural creature she is, it's not actually a dragon.

Eldritch abomination and that fell in love with her wolfie friend sounds about right, though.
Eclipse wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:36 pm
stlsf4003 wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:22 pm I don't know about ya'll, But I think we're heading into the comic end game here. characters gonna start dropping left right and center.
I doubt it. The comic probably isn't going to end until the Templar are defeated and there's still so many plot holes and various other unexplored elements left in the comic (Brahn/his daughter and the Master Mage, who hasn't even appeared yet, Trace and Flora's plans to go to Lyn'knoll, saving Adira and whatever's she's hiding about the Riftwell Tavern, Mrs. Nibbly's identity, the birth of Trace and Flora's child, Carver being stranded with the Western Basitins, Euchre and Sirus' motives, Kat's potential love traingle with Eric and Zen, Mike and Evals' differing goals). If this story is coming to an end soon, it would feel really rushed and/or incomplete. There's room for at least 3-5 more chapters, maybe more depending on what happens next. I don't think we're anywhere close to the end. In fact, I think we might be closer to the halfway point. Just because a lot of characters are dying and SOME plot points are coming together doesn't mean we're reaching the end.
Even if there are a few more chapters, this could still be end game (or more appropriately, the climax), with some stuff to wrap it up. A potential love triangle isn't a story thread, actually, that's more of a resolution. Eric feels like Kat is a sister, so there's no love triangle, he doesn't share her feelings, and Zen is a chance to move on. Mike and Evals will resolve their goals in the epilogue. The epilogue could probably end on the birth of Trace and Flora's child with us never even seeing it, which would be an awful tease, but also a good ending point. We should be allowed to see it though. Carver being stranded with the Western Basitins is enough of an ending for a super minor villain.

Nibs' identity could be revealed at the end of this chapter, or a conclusion. Reaching Lyn'knoll, which is right next door to Trace's manor also sounds like denouement chapter after the climax.

I think that the Clovis stuff will end, the manor and Trace having to make peace with his past will come down here. Next chapter will be confronting Brahn and Co, who were working with Clovis, so that leads in nicely. Euchre and Sirus will also probably come back in there for that storyline. They will have to rescue Adira, which I am not sure where that will fit in, but then the team will decide if they are still going to head to Lyn'knoll or try to make this new blended community work. Even though Lyn'knoll is a good dream, there's also a lot of value to the work being done in this town, and maybe staying around, manning up to change the world instead of flee from it has value too. So the last chapter would be the epilogue where we see the decisions the characters made to bring them to their happy endings and can close out on like, the birth of Trace and Flora's child.
There has been nothing in the comic to suggest Kat has any feelings for Zen either. She actually put on a shirt when he unconsciously got too friendly, in fact. So Tom would have to create an entire romance there if he chose to, and given the speed of other relationships in this series...

Cosmacelf wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:24 pm
stlsf4003 wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:59 pm
Bellhead wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:49 pm That *THUD* makes me think she partially yeeted him backward, toward the railing, hence why he was reaching for it. So whatever she is, she's strong. Very strong. By a rough estimate, knowing Remus was directly between Sythe and Nibs, that's roughly a 6-foot solid yeet, complete with pained grunting.
I think that's was mostly due to him being freaked out by.....whatever the hell he just saw and reaching out for anything he could get a hold of when he felt himself going over.

That thud is likely due to a full grown wolf falling a good 10 feet onto a solid stone or marble floor below.
No, the thud happened before he fell. The thud caused him to fall and break the railing he was clutching at. That is a seriously strong thud.

And Remus was totally freaked out by what he saw. My vote is dragon. I mean, we’ve already been told that anyways, right? The characters even talked about Mrs. Nibbly being a baby dragon.
I disagree, reread what he said: "What the Hell?! What is Tha-!" 'What the Hell, what is that' isn't something you'd say about something you've seen before. Remus has seen at least one dragon before that we know of (Reni) thanks to his taking part in the attack on the meeting in town. If what he saw was a dragon, even a baby, he'd be able to ID it. He was attacked by something he hadn't seen before, something that frightened him, given his pupils dilating and exclamation. Something solid and able to strike with significant strength, given the stylized "THUD!" that sent Remus to his supposed death (the railing was already compromised by Clovis' fireball earlier, so it's a poor indicator, but the way the word is stylized suggests a heavy blow, one at least strong enough to send a full sized warrior Wolf Keidran stumbling back enough to go through the gap Clovis blew in the balcony to his ultimate doom). We can also guess at size, he's not looking down but roughly straight on, suggesting that this new form is around equal in size.
stlsf4003 wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 12:02 am
Alea wrote: Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:45 pm Barring deistic intervention, it seems like Sythe is done for, given that he:
-Got hit with two consecutive fireballs
-Just passed out
-Has another brother with an equally big axe who most definitely heard that scream.

Remus, on the other hand, fell ~5 metres and people here are eulogizing him :P
Well the back of his head would hit the ground at about the same time his back did and as we all know, heads don't tend to shrug off that kind of blunt trauma easily.....

I could see the back of his head split wide open from a fall like that.
Depending on the angle, he could have hit head first, and lawn darting with your body weight on your neck is a great way to snap it.
Cinnibar wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:11 am Eldritch horror, or dragon....

Here's a thought. Nibs might be able to use that mana she got off Remus, on purpose or not. And did something with that rage and pain and determination. Poor Remus.

A very special squirrel is Nibs. :squirrel:

Actually, that might explain Nib's survival back at the fight with Carver, if being held by the magical Raine :raine: just in time and she can use that magic aura. She's familiar-material.
Don't forget the location, a magical hot spring? Lots of ambient magic there, enough to make rocks float even! ;)

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#22 Post by Bellhead »

steelabjur wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:21 pm I disagree, reread what he said: "What the Hell?! What is Tha-!" 'What the Hell, what is that' isn't something you'd say about something you've seen before. Remus has seen at least one dragon before that we know of (Reni) thanks to his taking part in the attack on the meeting in town. If what he saw was a dragon, even a baby, he'd be able to ID it. He was attacked by something he hadn't seen before, something that frightened him, given his pupils dilating and exclamation. Something solid and able to strike with significant strength, given the stylized "THUD!" that sent Remus to his supposed death (the railing was already compromised by Clovis' fireball earlier, so it's a poor indicator, but the way the word is stylized suggests a heavy blow, one at least strong enough to send a full sized warrior Wolf Keidran stumbling back enough to go through the gap Clovis blew in the balcony to his ultimate doom). We can also guess at size, he's not looking down but roughly straight on, suggesting that this new form is around equal in size.
I disagree with some of this. "What is that" is also often used in the situation where you see something that's just plain weird. For instance, if you walk down the sidewalk and see a bright yellow bird the size of a football blocking the path, that would be your exact reaction, likely with a few expletives thrown in for good measure. Also, it doesn't necessarily have to be solid, per se, just able to transmit a substantial impact. A creature whose form is completely obscured by smoke would be able to do that as well, and would elicit a similar reaction.

Now about his viewing angle... This one gets tricky. Remus is not small, by any means. And while we can discount that he wasn't looking down, who's to say he wasn't looking up to some degree? We can wager a guess based on the distance between his chin and chest floof as compared to the second and fourth panels that he was looking relatively straight forward, ish. Give or take. But also take into account that, as he was startled and stumbling backward, he was likely leaning back, and his floof would have been standing on-end, changing the perceived shape and size. If we go by that, and assuming Remus is something like 6' tall, then whatever he's seeing could very well be in excess of 8 feet. If we keep in mind that he may not have been looking at the head of an upright bi-pedal creature, it could be even larger. Larger still if we use the theory that Nibs is a baby dragon, where her head could lower to the height of a keidran with no trouble at all.

Or she could have taken the form of a large, shadow-covered bird and just hovered at his head height. All we really know is that he was scared stiff.
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#23 Post by steelabjur »

Bellhead wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:15 pm
steelabjur wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:21 pm I disagree, reread what he said: "What the Hell?! What is Tha-!" 'What the Hell, what is that' isn't something you'd say about something you've seen before. Remus has seen at least one dragon before that we know of (Reni) thanks to his taking part in the attack on the meeting in town. If what he saw was a dragon, even a baby, he'd be able to ID it. He was attacked by something he hadn't seen before, something that frightened him, given his pupils dilating and exclamation. Something solid and able to strike with significant strength, given the stylized "THUD!" that sent Remus to his supposed death (the railing was already compromised by Clovis' fireball earlier, so it's a poor indicator, but the way the word is stylized suggests a heavy blow, one at least strong enough to send a full sized warrior Wolf Keidran stumbling back enough to go through the gap Clovis blew in the balcony to his ultimate doom). We can also guess at size, he's not looking down but roughly straight on, suggesting that this new form is around equal in size.
I disagree with some of this. "What is that" is also often used in the situation where you see something that's just plain weird. For instance, if you walk down the sidewalk and see a bright yellow bird the size of a football blocking the path, that would be your exact reaction, likely with a few expletives thrown in for good measure. Also, it doesn't necessarily have to be solid, per se, just able to transmit a substantial impact. A creature whose form is completely obscured by smoke would be able to do that as well, and would elicit a similar reaction.

Now about his viewing angle... This one gets tricky. Remus is not small, by any means. And while we can discount that he wasn't looking down, who's to say he wasn't looking up to some degree? We can wager a guess based on the distance between his chin and chest floof as compared to the second and fourth panels that he was looking relatively straight forward, ish. Give or take. But also take into account that, as he was startled and stumbling backward, he was likely leaning back, and his floof would have been standing on-end, changing the perceived shape and size. If we go by that, and assuming Remus is something like 6' tall, then whatever he's seeing could very well be in excess of 8 feet. If we keep in mind that he may not have been looking at the head of an upright bi-pedal creature, it could be even larger. Larger still if we use the theory that Nibs is a baby dragon, where her head could lower to the height of a keidran with no trouble at all.

Or she could have taken the form of a large, shadow-covered bird and just hovered at his head height. All we really know is that he was scared stiff.
Yes, I would say "what is that" if I saw "a bright yellow bird the size of a football", because I've never seen "a bright yellow bird the size of a football" before. If I saw "a bright yellow bird the size of a football" a few days before (as Remus has seen a dragon), I wouldn't react that way. Nor would I react that way to a bright yellow bird the size of a baseball that shortly after seeing "a bright yellow bird the size of a football".
I've yet to encounter a non-solid body that could make a THUD encountering a solid body (maybe a semi-solid body). "A creature whose form is completely obscured by smoke" would still have a form under that smoke, and THUD suggests that form is solid.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#24 Post by Technic[Bot] »

So commenting on the current conversation threads:
Some wrote: The thud implies whatever pushed Remus is big and strong
No necessarily Remus is still in pain and probably a bit stunned, he just saw something that scared him out of his own loincloth, that he was already missing. It would not take a very strong push for him to loose balance and stumble down into the railing which then broke under the wolf weight. Moreover I think it is not "something" pushing him but he backing out in fear and stumbling with against the railing.
Some other wrote: Remus is death he is gonna break his neck and wold mercenary is now death!
Sure if he fall on his head, but it is only a one-story fall. He is likely incapacitated for the rest of the chapter but unlike Brutus his death does not have that much story significance. So i think after the place is leveled we may see Romulus walking away with his injured brother. Or maybe Nibs does not want anyone knowing what she is and goes for the kill...

On the other hand over the past 3 week Tom has been subverting our expectations one week after another. It works for us because we have to wait one week for a new page , but for new readers, it will feel like the author goes one way then changes his mind over the course of a couple pages.

Also alternative theory, he did not saw Nibs, he saw something else, the manor is full of experiments and other defenses, there is no shortage of abominations in there.
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#25 Post by Spiffydragon »

Judging by the height of the railing, the fall is around 24-30'. People have survived jumping from bridges of 40' and landing on the creek rocks and concrete below and still survive but that is with first world medicine and the best knowledge available; they usually end up with multiple broken bones from it as well. Aside from magic, no such treatments exist for Remus or anyone else. It's not impossible for Remus to survive the fall and I hope he does get to continue on with life but it's unlikely. Even if he protects his head from the fall, his spine, pelvis, and probably legs will have multiple breaks and fractures from it and the possibility of walking away with just bruises is statistically nil.

Had one kid perform some ninja bush-pull backflip / fall to the tune of 10-15' into a creek bed (rocks) and he still needed to be walked back to the road and get a ride to medical for a concussion. I forget if he was wearing his helmet or not but he ended up being fine and got to skip out of a pretty miserable time.

I have a hard time believing this comic is even half way over since I binge read it not too long ago; I got the impression this story is literally just starting, despite it being in the works for so many years.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#26 Post by Alea »

Spiffydragon wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 12:10 am Judging by the height of the railing, the fall is around 24-30'. People have survived jumping from bridges of 40' and landing on the creek rocks and concrete below and still survive but that is with first world medicine and the best knowledge available; they usually end up with multiple broken bones from it as well. Aside from magic, no such treatments exist for Remus or anyone else. It's not impossible for Remus to survive the fall and I hope he does get to continue on with life but it's unlikely. Even if he protects his head from the fall, his spine, pelvis, and probably legs will have multiple breaks and fractures from it and the possibility of walking away with just bruises is statistically nil.

Had one kid perform some ninja bush-pull backflip / fall to the tune of 10-15' into a creek bed (rocks) and he still needed to be walked back to the road and get a ride to medical for a concussion. I forget if he was wearing his helmet or not but he ended up being fine and got to skip out of a pretty miserable time.

I have a hard time believing this comic is even half way over since I binge read it not too long ago; I got the impression this story is literally just starting, despite it being in the works for so many years.
I don't really think you can equate a fall of 24' with a fall of 40' since mortality increases exponentially with fall height , and most people who do die from falls are either very old or very young. For plot reasons, I think it's unlikely that Remus gets up again; he's more likely to need to be carried out.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#27 Post by steelabjur »

You know, we're thinking what attacked Remus was Mrs. Nibbly, but for all we know, she's a squirrel-shaped pile of smoking ash on the floor. You know what Remus probably hasn't seen before? A Basitin, as Keith and company left the square for the docks before Clovis and his men attacked the meeting and their not at all common on the mainland. Lynn could very well have come on a strange wolf (Remus) attacking one of Trace's guests (Sythe) and intervened, punching/pushing Remus and accidently leading to his fall.

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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#28 Post by Dracosapien83 »

Ah yes, the classic "character-passes-out-before-he-can-see who-just-saved-his-butt" scenario.

I think Mr. Rodriguez says it best.
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#29 Post by tony1695 »

steelabjur wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:41 am You know, we're thinking what attacked Remus was Mrs. Nibbly, but for all we know, she's a squirrel-shaped pile of smoking ash on the floor. You know what Remus probably hasn't seen before? A Basitin, as Keith and company left the square for the docks before Clovis and his men attacked the meeting and their not at all common on the mainland. Lynn could very well have come on a strange wolf (Remus) attacking one of Trace's guests (Sythe) and intervened, punching/pushing Remus and accidently leading to his fall.
His reaction feels too extreme for it to be Lynn (the only Basitin not in the beach room) attacking him. But you do make a good point about something else being what pushed him off. The only defences we know about so far are the "polymorph intruder" spell and the small group of mindless lizard golems. Wouldn't surprise me if there's another layer of security we have yet to see. Or perhaps Rose has managed to regain a little control over the manor and is using that to dispatch the invaders.
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Re: Comic for March 20, 2021: Remus' Downfall

#30 Post by Spiffydragon »

Alea wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:12 am
I don't really think you can equate a fall of 24' with a fall of 40' since mortality increases exponentially with fall height , and most people who do die from falls are either very old or very young. For plot reasons, I think it's unlikely that Remus gets up again; he's more likely to need to be carried out.
I stand corrected; I also saved that white paper for future reference, these little details are important. I can't help but still root for the mercenary twins to escape alive, they are too cute.

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