Thoughts on the Furry Community?

[y7h65]

You have a point there. Although according to the legends the supernatural foxes could also be succubus like seducers, so I think these very legends are what caused the fox to be associated with sexuality to begin with.

Hence why in the twokinds comic Eric wanted another fox girl, why Michelle was pretty hot and why calling someone "foxy" is a synonym for "sexy".

That would make sense, if it weren't for the fact that the mythological Kitsune were not commonly portrayed as succubus like seducers so much as either A) A messanger from one of the key deities of Shintoism or B) A Trickster. When they're tricksters, they're even noted in that wikipedia link to just simply enjoy either playing tricks on the upper class of Japan or outright abusing the lower class. Even then when they are portrayed as lovers, Kitsunes " may be a seductress, but these stories are more often romantic in nature".

Also, keep in mind, the word foxy is foxy slang from the 16th century. While it's attachment to describe someone as attractive is, in fact, from after Japan reopened it's borders; the word fox has always been used in its slang form to describe someone who is tricky, clever, wily, and/or cunning. So I have some pretty good reason to believe that a mythological creature from Japan did not exactly cause or create that association so much as it was a natural evolution of the use of that phrase.

[primalcaller ergos]

While that is true, north america and europe also have their own ancient myths about sexy trickster animal spirits.

That could very well be related to the expression "Sly as a fox".

[FishWeave]

I'm pretty indifferent towards the furry community. When I was a teenage, a place called furcadia was super popular. In trying to see what sort of place it was or what kind of people went there, for the most part I was completely ignored since I wasn't part of their groups, despite their claims that the places were open to anyone to join in conversations. I was actually kicked out of one place on furcadia that claimed it was an open to talk place. The reason? Because one of the people in charge was a nurse and at that time I had recently found out I had cancer. The nurse claimed a kind of skin cancer that goes under the skin doesn't exist, so I was lying. I was kicked out for basically trying to seek advise from someone I had thought would at least give a yes or no. After that I pretty much gave up on trying to connect to the community all together, though I would still occasionally try for a few more years. I have made art and have created art that would be considered furry, but it was simply to make art. I have friends that are part of that community but I don't really see myself as actually being part of it. I have never had any good experiences with trying to connect with the furry as a community. I see myself as a winged serpent sort of animal and only that, even if I connect to a lot of others. Would I be considered a furry? No idea, labels don't really matter that much to me. I do think it would be a bit pointless to call myself one though when I don't feel wanted or welcome by the community, even if I would fit what being a furry means.

[TheMouse]

Hoo boy. So, I'll start with 'I'm not a psychologist' and 'all of this is based on experience and conjecture'. And this is the cliff notes version, because I'm too scattered tonight for the full depth.

A huge portion of kink comes down to power exchange. The giving and taking of power, by two consenting adults. Where this kicks into furry territory is that whole predator and prey thing. Like it or not, a fair number of furries don't just like anthro art, they in some way identify with animals. In varying degrees, but it still means something. So someone who identifies with, for example, a mouse, and someone as a cat? What do you think that relationship is going to be like? Again, not all cases, but enough to prompt that diagram and a fairly strong opinion both inside and outside the community.

And animals! The surprise isn't that so many people choose wolves and tigers and such, but that anyone doesn't. We're inclined toward things we can identify with, especially in fiction. Which are you more likely to identify with? The well known pack relationships associated with wolves, or... what do moles even do? Dig in dirt and be blind? We're drawn in fiction and in escapism not only to things we see in ourselves, but things we wish we saw in ourselves.

[ReBob]

A diverse, widely varying culture.
A sexually heightened group, that has it's own merit apart from the explicit.
An internet culture based around dressing up in what resembles mascot costumes.
A niche following for people who are close to animals.
An average internet association that takes itself far too seriously.
I find the fandom to be strange.
I find the fandom to be interesting.
I find the fandom to be appalling.
I find the fandom to be enjoyable.
My perception of the group is positive.
My perception of the group is negative.
I would classify myself as a furry.

I hope the hypocrisy in my views is understandable. I don't think every member of the community is a participant in every facet, and liking certain parts of the furry community (like anthro art) doesn't mean one is a furry.

[y7h65]

Spero, the line ' It's a fetish, an unnatural human attraction, and we all have them. It can't be expected for others to not find the explicit art repulsive, but at the same time I see it as being no worse' is terribly vague. That's why I responded about the fetish thing since, to me, it read like you were calling fetishes in general unnatural.

primalcaller, I literally just posted that the phrase foxy being in reference to a person being attractive is an evolution of it's earlier roots as a phrase referring to a person being who is tricky, clever, wily, and/or cunning. You did not have to say it again. Also, I just looked up the list of tricksters on wikipedia and looked up all the links. Of all of them, there are six or seven that are animals. I think two of them could be considered sexy.

Mouse, traits commonly attributed to the mole is wisdom and humility. I mean, most animals used as fursoans aren't exactly word for word the same as the actual animal. Anyways, my point isn't about what animals are being selected for the fursona. It's also understandable that everyone has this huge idealized self in their mind. That one version of yourself that most people have, that is everything you want to be and more. That's not, to my knowledge, abnormal. However it's the fact that everyone in the furry fandom picks fursonas that are, essentially, their idealized self. They're the only fandom I've seen that frequently presents this idealized version of themselves as their 'true' self with vigor that I have not seen anywhere else. I know plenty of people who play tabletop RPGs who play blatantly idealized versions of themselves but even they don't push this idealized version of themselves onto others like how the furry fandom does.

[Bellhead]

A long time ago, in a hidden line in a thread long buried, I posted how I became so attatched to the fandom, and why it means so much to me. http://twokinds.net/forum/viewtopic.php ... 34#p806634 It's still there, as far as I know... If you decide to read that, warning: feels.

Anyway, I've come to see the fandom as being an accepting group of misfits who like anthro art of varying types and degrees of content. Here, I could talk about some of the most controversial political topics ever discussed, and people would still contribute thoughtful insights. No opinion is right or wrong, because (as stated) there is no elite, and there is no central piece of media we revolve around (Trekkies, for instance, have Star Trek). We have no general preference lean, like most places. Any one of us can be as free as we want; free to do, say, draw and act however we wish when among each other, without fear of judgement for being in the "wrong crowd" or having "incorrect beliefs". And that, I think, is why society dislikes us.

If we take a step back and look upon society, we see that the bulk of what society does is limit how we act, what we think, what we do and how we live. Furry has no limit, no boundary on these matters. A furry could be a straight white Christian night clerk at a gas station, or a bisexual black athiest desk worker, or any other combination of anything, and we wouldn't give a damn, because here it's perfectly acceptable and even encouraged at times to be yourself and not let anyone tell you who you are. Society does not like that level of personal freedom of thought. So yes, we are naturally the target of media attacks and other forms of bullying, simply for not being exclusive.

One last thing: I had not heard that furries were so prone to defending themselves more than anyone else. Moreso than others, possibly, but only proportional to the level of hate we get. If, all of the sudden, society started hating on, say, people who drink alcohol for recreation as severely as they do the Furry Fandom, they would be just as quick if not a LOT quicker to try to prove everyone wrong. Even here, I've read stories of people being insulted for being furry, but usually, it is seen more with sadness than anger or retaliation.

So yeah, I like it here. Yes, there's wierdos, and yes, we're a bunch if deviants in many ways, but I see that more as us being free and expressive of who we are than simply us being so far from the societal norm.

[primalcaller ergos]

One thing I find a little strange about the fandom though, is the "otherkin" portion of it that thinks they are literally animals in the wrong body.

I mean, I find it quite interesting when people have a fursona that they beleive in as a metaphor or ideal, but outright vocally denying your humanity is kinda creepy.

I even think coming up with animal personalities for yourself and your friends is adorable.

In comparison a lot of my friends who play stuff like warcraft or warhammer have Orc/Ork characters they roleplay as but they don't outright declare themselves to be Orcs incorrectly born into a human body....

[FishWeave]

Not every otherkin thinks they were a fantasy creature in another life, some think that their soul is simply different then their body. I have met otherkin who didn't believe in reincarnation. Personalities, ages, and belief systems vary a large deal between different otherkin. The only requirement for someone to be an otherkin is to have a soul that doesn't match your body. Therians are a sub category of otherkin.

I've found the otherkin community to always have been worlds more accepting then anything I ever experienced in the furry community. In the furry community I was either mostly ignored for not being part of their group, even attached and banned once for claiming to have a kind of cancer that one person didn't think existed. No facts were looked up, nobody listened, just straight ban for saying I had cancer while I had been a teenager. Otherkin communities on the other hand I have never found to automatically attack anyone who enters the community. Though they can get very defensive and up in arms at times, its more because people are so quick to attack the community or try to roleplay as being an otherkin. Because of all the internal issues they rarely gather in large numbers, but at the least...

I have never seen one gathering of otherkin that had people getting ignored for not being part of their group. Also, I never saw anyone accused by an otherkin group of faking a serious possibly life threatening thing simply because you don't know it off the top of your head. While I am not technically an otherkin, I still consider myself part of that community.

[primalcaller ergos]

One thing I find a little strange about the fandom though, is the "otherkin" portion of it that thinks they are literally animals in the wrong body.

Actually, otherkin are people who generally believe they're reincarnates of mystical or intangible creatures (such as stars or whatnot); while therians believe they're animals born into a human body. The internet's mixed the words up pretty good, as of late.

I was never bothered by therians, in all honesty. You relate to an animal and want to believe you're one of that animal, to quote Jacksfilms: "cool cool'. Even though I don't believe in it I don't think it's unhealthy, and it's cool to have a connection to nature. Even if someone in that position could have arguably taken it too far. In almost any case, however, it's simply a phase that passes by

I guess the net really did, because other people have told me that it's the other way around: That otherkin means "wrong body" and therian means "reincarnated".
Still I suppose it would not the be first time someone mixed up their terms on me. Either way I get what you mean.

Well the thing is, I don't think it is particularily unhealthy either, just that it can be in the specific isolated cases of certain individuals.

Either way although I do think that openly declaring a rejection of your humanity is a little bit creepy, it's small enough that I let it slide.
Heck some of my best friends are therians.

[Warrl]

Still I suppose it would not the be first time someone mixed up their terms on me.

If you take the words apart and look at the Greek origin of their parts, we got sympathy and empathy reversed. Feeling sorry for someone who is in pain should be empathy and actually sharing the pain should be sympathy.

[Commander-Strife]

I personally like the Furry Community but...

To my experience, it's just filled with drama. Sure, like many others, but... I've had times when fellow Furries have literally just made up stuff for the sole purpose of stirring drama. It wouldn't be fair to say this doesn't happen in any other, namely the Brony Community and with supernatural fans on occasion, it just... seems to honestly happen more often with Furries than any other that I'm a part of. That and I kinda quit the fandom about 7 years ago due to the fact that everyone I knew in it turned out to be just... awful, mean people and that kinda stops me from getting into it again and acknowledging myself as one of them and being all like "Hey, let's talk about furry stuff or whatever".

That and any Furries I've Roleplayed with lately all eventually stop replying entirely, even if the RP itself is getting good. That honestly is also a good reason why I no longer roleplay to begin with (that and nobody wants to do a long, continuous adventure-style RP, which I was craving) despite how well I apparently can do slime creatures (according to a few people, I'm "the best they've ever known").

But I like it still. It's got good, talented people, some of whom are still my friend because they're not mean and talk to me when I say Hi once in a while. It's still as interesting to me as the day I found it back in 5th grade.