Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

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aitaituo
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#16 Post by aitaituo »

rwstyles wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:51 am
Technic[Bot] wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:20 am So nothing unexpected here. I may sound like a broken record at this point but still. I am surprised a slave cuff made specifically for the prince of greed Clovis could be beaten by some human unremarkt human slaver. Either Eric is very damn good or those cuffs are not as jazzed up as we made them up to be.

Also failsafe? Not entirely sure I would have used that word. Yet English is not my first language so probably you should not take grammar lessons from me

Also seems we have confirmation that Kat has never worn a slave collar before. Which i find weird. I mean Eric said he never made her wear one and I believe him. But his original owners his parents had not reason not to nor his brother Roderick specially his brother.
So I wonder why did Eric's family bought Kat specifically and why did they never bothered to put a slave collar on her?

Finally Zen really had some history with the Roman twins. You do not just daydream about shanking the guy who drank all your breakfast milk.
They have the same problem with default logins and passwords we have.
Plausible. But really, using magic to deactivate a toggleable enchanted device makes a lot of sense. I know there was a lot of speculation in the previous threads that somehow the collar would be able to only respond to specific masters, but how would that work? It's magic, not a computer. If it's going to be limited like that, it's going to be limited in the same way a physical lock is, not an iPhone doing voice recognition. And every lock can be picked, smashed, or disassembled, no matter how sophisticated it is.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#17 Post by multilis »

Technic[Bot] wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:20 am I am surprised a slave cuff made specifically for the prince of greed Clovis could be beaten by some human unremarkt human slaver. Either Eric is very damn good or those cuffs are not as jazzed up as we made them up to be.
Prince of greed may not spend more money/resources on items than he has to, so he has more money left. (Greed often equals frugal/mizor) Misuse of slave collars could put the noble slave collar business in disrepute, which would be bad for business, so natural that a good slave trader would know ways to stop collars when required... It can even be as simple as a customer gives poorly worded orders to his property then can't be found and slave is causing trouble as result and slave trader needs to shut down the slave without harming the customers property, just send customer a bill for the service and slave trader makes a profit and has good will for future sales. ;)

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#18 Post by Bellhead »

Tornir wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:01 pm If Zen and Kat do get together, will Zen find himself on the receiving end of the Protective Brother routine from Eric that he gave to Keith?
Natani has been living with Kat for a while, so I doubt he'd have much issue with her, knowing her character as well as he does. But besides that, Zen's always been rather protective, usually a little overprotective, of Natani. And I'm sure Natani doesn't see Kat as being quite as fragile as Zen sees/saw Nat, and I tend to think he wouldn't have the emotional tether to Kat that Zen had to him.

In short, I think Zen made that speech because he didn't want to lose Nat, and since Natani doesn't have that emotional dynamic with Kat, I think we'll be OK.
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#19 Post by MuonNeutrino »

Regarding Eric being able to shut off the shackle, Tom had an interesting thing to say about the magical tech behind the control shackles during a stream:
Tom, in a stream wrote: <People had been wondering in chat whether control collars would work on humans>
It's magic, and works at some level that effects keidran specifically.
Even the ones Keidran use are based on the Templar ones. They're actually a fairly recent invention.
The keidran haven't managed to reverse engineer it yet, so there's no human ones.
In other words, it sounds like the keidran haven't actually figured out yet how the control spells actually work. As such, I think it'd be plausible that even if Clovis did enchant this shackle personally, he still might not know how to block any of the methods Eric might know of for disabling one. To use Aitaituo's analogy, the keidran are copying a templar lock here without knowing how it actually works, and so the same master key the templar built in still works on it.
Bellhead wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 7:58 pm
Tornir wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:01 pm If Zen and Kat do get together, will Zen find himself on the receiving end of the Protective Brother routine from Eric that he gave to Keith?
Natani has been living with Kat for a while, so I doubt he'd have much issue with her, knowing her character as well as he does. But besides that, Zen's always been rather protective, usually a little overprotective, of Natani. And I'm sure Natani doesn't see Kat as being quite as fragile as Zen sees/saw Nat, and I tend to think he wouldn't have the emotional tether to Kat that Zen had to him.

In short, I think Zen made that speech because he didn't want to lose Nat, and since Natani doesn't have that emotional dynamic with Kat, I think we'll be OK.
I'm pretty sure Tornir was suggesting that *Eric* might give *Zen* the 'overprotective sibling you better treat her right' speech, not that Natani would give such a speech to Kat. I could see it happening too, assuming that a hypothetical Kat-Zen ship does eventually start to show signs of setting sail.
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#20 Post by Warrl »

Bellhead wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 7:58 pm
Tornir wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:01 pm If Zen and Kat do get together, will Zen find himself on the receiving end of the Protective Brother routine from Eric that he gave to Keith?
Natani has been living with Kat for a while, so I doubt he'd have much issue with her, knowing her character as well as he does. But besides that, Zen's always been rather protective, usually a little overprotective, of Natani. And I'm sure Natani doesn't see Kat as being quite as fragile as Zen sees/saw Nat, and I tend to think he wouldn't have the emotional tether to Kat that Zen had to him.

In short, I think Zen made that speech because he didn't want to lose Nat, and since Natani doesn't have that emotional dynamic with Kat, I think we'll be OK.
The question was about Eric giving that speech to Zen. Which is plausible - Eric has only known Zen for a few days, and Zen has spent most of that time sick in bed.

Natani would be giving it to Katherin. Except I don't see that happening, they already know each other pretty well.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#21 Post by MatyMaty »

I don't think Clovis expected things to just go so awry, and less alone to have a slaver around to disable the cuff. Funnily so, if Rem had not gone after Sythe and gotten himself killed by a squirrel, the brothers could have easily dealt with Kat and Zen together.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#22 Post by Tornir »

I'm not sure Zen is the primary objective of this mission. I think Reni is.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#23 Post by stlsf4003 »

Tornir wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 9:30 am I'm not sure Zen is the primary objective of this mission. I think Reni is.
If your talking about Clovis' mission. It was get into the manor, bump Brutus off, grab Nat and Zen and then get the hell outta dodge.

Needless to say that everything has pretty much gone sideways for Clovis at this point. Two of his men are dead and he's now locked in a battle of life and death with a dragon!
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#24 Post by Tornir »

stlsf4003 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 6:25 pmIf your talking about Clovis' mission. It was get into the manor, bump Brutus off, grab Nat and Zen and then get the hell outta dodge.

Needless to say that everything has pretty much gone sideways for Clovis at this point. Two of his men are dead and he's now locked in a battle of life and death with a dragon!
For a couple of underpaid assassins, the time, effort and cost doesn't seem worth it. He's had to conspire with the Templar to start a wolf/tiger war to earn that extremely labor intensive amulet that got him past the manors access control system, and has so far lost five men. Considering that plan executed before Nat and Zen had even arrived at the manor, they couldn't have been the objective.

Now, the access control system was installed by Nora, and Clovis and the boys walked straight in without getting transformed. That's what I think this mission is about; battle testing that big red derg nerfer. The altercation with Reni is just the icing on the cake; I don't know if she'll survive it, but I'm pretty confident Clovis will.

I believe Clovis' ultimate objective is revenge on Nora; if the info on the DA ref sheet is canon, she's definitely a target.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#25 Post by Eclipse »

Tornir wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 9:35 pm
stlsf4003 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 6:25 pmIf your talking about Clovis' mission. It was get into the manor, bump Brutus off, grab Nat and Zen and then get the hell outta dodge.

Needless to say that everything has pretty much gone sideways for Clovis at this point. Two of his men are dead and he's now locked in a battle of life and death with a dragon!
For a couple of underpaid assassins, the time, effort and cost doesn't seem worth it. He's had to conspire with the Templar to start a wolf/tiger war to earn that extremely labor intensive amulet that got him past the manors access control system, and has so far lost five men. Considering that plan executed before Nat and Zen had even arrived at the manor, they couldn't have been the objective.

Now, the access control system was installed by Nora, and Clovis and the boys walked straight in without getting transformed. That's what I think this mission is about; battle testing that big red derg nerfer. The altercation with Reni is just the icing on the cake; I don't know if she'll survive it, but I'm pretty confident Clovis will.

I believe Clovis' ultimate objective is revenge on Nora; if the info on the DA ref sheet is canon, she's definitely a target.
Clovis wants revenge on Natani, Zen, and Nora, all three of them played a part in his curse. He most likely is springing for the extra power to take out Nora, if it was just Natani and Zen he probably wouldn't have needed to go through all of that trouble, but he probably doesn't know where Nora is right now but he does know where Natani and Zen are. So they're his first target simply because they're more in reach.

IDK why you said Reni is the target and now saying his ultimate objective is Nora, that's a contradiction. He doesn't know Reni that well and she wasn't involved in the Dragon Masquerade incident, so I don't think she's near the top of his revenge list. She might climb up there after this point and he probably wasn't that fond of her to begin with, but she probably wouldn't rank above the other three (maybe even after Trace, so four really).

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#26 Post by Tornir »

I don't think Reni is a target for revenge, I think she's a target because she's a derg; Clovis needs to make sure the amulet works to spec.
I feel it's safe to assume he won't get a second chance if he goes up against Nora, and it doesn't. It's nothing personal, just business (although when we left those two, it was getting a bit personal).

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#27 Post by Eclipse »

Tornir wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 7:52 am I don't think Reni is a target for revenge, I think she's a target because she's a derg; Clovis needs to make sure the amulet works to spec.
I feel it's safe to assume he won't get a second chance if he goes up against Nora, and it doesn't. It's nothing personal, just business (although when we left those two, it was getting a bit personal).
Thing is that revenge is Clovis' primary motivation for operation, so his biggest targets are the ones he wants revenge on. Being a dragon doesn't do Reni any favors, but Clovis didn't specifically begin this operation looking to take her out because she hasn't really wronged him. She's a wrinkle in Clovis' plans, an unexpected enemy that he has to deal with. Clovis is only fighting her because she's the enemy right in front of him, Reni initiated the battle between them if you notice because she detected his presence and knows from Brutus' memories that he was behind the attack on Edenmire. Clovis is going to have to defeat her to continue his revenge tour, but he didn't really plan to fight her.

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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#28 Post by Technic[Bot] »

Bellhead wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 12:38 am
Regarding Kat's lack of collar experience: Kat was born into Eric's family, not bought. And given how close the two have always been, Eric would likely have strongly fought against putting a collar on her. We don't even know if there's a minimum age for collar use, and I doubt that Eric's family would refuse their son his closest childhood friend, anyway. It's still a bit far from normal for her to have never experienced it, but given their relationship and history, it makes a bit of sense in this situation.
I have always considered Kat origin to be a bit inconsistent at best. Both in comic and on he Ref sheet it is said she was bought by Eric, and that the only reason he was allowd to buy him was because she is infertile. Yet at the very beginning Eric said he bought him from Roderick and then at the end of the boat incident Eric says she was born into his family.
I mean at the end of the day it can go simply as: She was born into the family, then Rodrerick inherited her and once he realized she could not be bred sold her to Eric. Yet seems like a really roundabout and complicated story. It also implies Eric family do not only trade slaves but also actively breeds sex slaves...
MuonNeutrino wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:30 am Regarding Kat and collars, Tom had this to say in a stream a while back:
Tom, in a stream wrote: And no, Kat's never had a control collar on
Control collars are a pretty recent invention and weren't really in common use until after Trace's instatement.
Rich people had them. Kat's owners might have had them, but for domestic servants, it's a matter of pride that Keidran are 'broken' properly.
Using a collar kinda goes against it when it just subverts their will.
If the collar stops working, suddenly you have unruly Keidran.
Slave collars don't seem to be as widespread as it might seem from just the few we've seen in the comic, or at least not until recently.
MuonNeutrino wrote: Thu Jul 08, 2021 1:30 am Regarding Kat and collars, Tom had this to say in a stream a while back:
Tom, in a stream wrote: And no, Kat's never had a control collar on
Control collars are a pretty recent invention and weren't really in common use until after Trace's instatement.
Rich people had them. Kat's owners might have had them, but for domestic servants, it's a matter of pride that Keidran are 'broken' properly.
Using a collar kinda goes against it when it just subverts their will.
If the collar stops working, suddenly you have unruly Keidran.
Slave collars don't seem to be as widespread as it might seem from just the few we've seen in the comic, or at least not until recently.
That explains why Eric managed to disable the cuff. They are simply similar to what he uses. Really wish we got this tiny bits of lore ellaborated somewhere. Comic is not dense enought to pack all this information and sometimes it is reallyt relevant to the story, moreover since it is just stored in places like this forum it is likely to be lost at some point.

But I digres... I imagine collars are basically either invented by Trace or he simply managed to mass produce something designed before by the templars. If that is the case maybe Trace has some Human collars around, either protoypes or well, he was into necromancy he probably needed some human volunteers to experiment on....
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#29 Post by Bellhead »

Technic[Bot] wrote: I have always considered Kat origin to be a bit inconsistent at best. Both in comic and on he Ref sheet it is said she was bought by Eric, and that the only reason he was allowd to buy him was because she is infertile. Yet at the very beginning Eric said he bought him from Roderick and then at the end of the boat incident Eric says she was born into his family.
I mean at the end of the day it can go simply as: She was born into the family, then Rodrerick inherited her and once he realized she could not be bred sold her to Eric. Yet seems like a really roundabout and complicated story. It also implies Eric family do not only trade slaves but also actively breeds sex slaves...
I would assume her story goes something like, "was bred to be a sex slave, was given to Roderick as a birthday present at some very early age, was bought by Eric later on". That was my interpretation, based on what we've seen and heard so far.

And yeah, I wouldn't put it past a family of slave traders to breed slaves to be sold for a specific purpose, especially one as lucrative as the sex trade. It's a long term investment, to be sure, but not one slave traders would hesitate to make.
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Re: Comic for July 7, 2021: Eric To The Rescue

#30 Post by Kyrit »

Anyone else wondering where Kat's hairband vanished to in the last panel?

More in line with current discussion;
Reni has nothing to do with Clovis being at the estate. He and his men didn't seem to be expecting a dragon back at the festival. In fact, I'd say he was quite upset that he hadn't been told about her. But he already got what he came to town for; the amulet. Zen and Nat could have been a lovely bonus, but even then the only reason he really came to the estate was to handle Brutus. If it had just been Zen or Nat he probably would've just waited for an easier chance to get his hands on them, but his feelings for Brutus and the risks he was willing to take for him could not be risked any longer.

That said, Reni's definitely a target now that she's made herself one. Not part of the original goal, but she's in his way and he's got a new anti-dragon toy.

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