Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

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amenon
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#46 Post by amenon »

Esn wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:12 am
Technic[Bot] wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:48 amAlso Tom has a thing whit understaffing places: Eric's ship was handled by two slaves and Eric alone. A ship that large cannot be handled with soo little people.
I could have sworn that there were more than 2 slaves on the ship, but you might be right actually... although, Eric does call them his "two best men" here:
http://twokinds.keenspot.com/comic/375/
Would he really do that if they were also his ONLY men? I wish I could just assume that everyone else is just out of sight... but... they're also the only two who accompanied him to Trace's estate...
Evals and Mike were probably originally representative of a bigger crew, but by now they were the entire crew. Because if they weren't, the plot breaks:

1) If there's more slaves, there would have been a mutiny
2) If there's more non-slaves, mutiny wouldn't have been on the table

and more recently

3) Any extras would have been kinda had to have been addressed somewhere around the ship explosion, yeah.

In conclusion, the Na'Rella is (was) magic. (Also potatos.)

Tyger42 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am 2) How little time in-story has actually passed. Flora's been pregnant for, what, nearly 10 years now real time?
We're coming up on 13 years since conception! The pregnancy is about to be a teenager :grin:
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#47 Post by Hulk10 »

amenon wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:49 pm
Esn wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:12 am
Technic[Bot] wrote: Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:48 amAlso Tom has a thing whit understaffing places: Eric's ship was handled by two slaves and Eric alone. A ship that large cannot be handled with soo little people.
I could have sworn that there were more than 2 slaves on the ship, but you might be right actually... although, Eric does call them his "two best men" here:
http://twokinds.keenspot.com/comic/375/
Would he really do that if they were also his ONLY men? I wish I could just assume that everyone else is just out of sight... but... they're also the only two who accompanied him to Trace's estate...
Evals and Mike were probably originally representative of a bigger crew, but by now they were the entire crew. Because if they weren't, the plot breaks:

1) If there's more slaves, there would have been a mutiny
2) If there's more non-slaves, mutiny wouldn't have been on the table

and more recently

3) Any extras would have been kinda had to have been addressed somewhere around the ship explosion, yeah.

In conclusion, the Na'Rella is (was) magic. (Also potatos.)

Tyger42 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am 2) How little time in-story has actually passed. Flora's been pregnant for, what, nearly 10 years now real time?
We're coming up on 13 years since conception! The pregnancy is about to be a teenager :grin:
I can understand Trace's inability to resist Flora.
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#48 Post by stlsf4003 »

Ghost or not, there's something very off about this mansion and it's caretaker.

I'm willing to make a bet that's it's all tied together with whatever is on the Third floor and when we find out what's up there, things are gonna go south in a big way.
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#49 Post by Tyger42 »

Hulk10 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:50 am
Tyger42 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am Speaking of Keith's old eyes... Going through the archives, 2 things hit me:

1) I've mentioned before, but it's fun watching the progression and refinement of the art over the years. There's no clear lines of sudden jumps in quality. It's been gradual, but the difference between today's comics and the first ones is night and day.

2) How little time in-story has actually passed. Flora's been pregnant for, what, nearly 10 years now real time?
I don't think she's been pregnant that long in real time.
Well, in story, no, it hasn't been that long. But real life dating from the first comic where she conceived.... Apparently it's been longer.

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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#50 Post by Elemental Templar »

Tyger42 wrote: Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:32 am
Hulk10 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:50 am
Tyger42 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am Speaking of Keith's old eyes... Going through the archives, 2 things hit me:

1) I've mentioned before, but it's fun watching the progression and refinement of the art over the years. There's no clear lines of sudden jumps in quality. It's been gradual, but the difference between today's comics and the first ones is night and day.

2) How little time in-story has actually passed. Flora's been pregnant for, what, nearly 10 years now real time?
I don't think she's been pregnant that long in real time.
Well, in story, no, it hasn't been that long. But real life dating from the first comic where she conceived.... Apparently it's been longer.
To be a little more specific, she's at around two-months into her pregnancy as of page 1009 and to Finally put this thread at ease as to where Flora is, does anybody remember her dialog from this page?

We're probably gonna get a cut to her in the baths in a page or two, maybe even with Maren offering to groom her.

Which I can imagine being kinda awkward... But that's just my theory anyone else?
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#51 Post by Technic[Bot] »

amenon wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:49 pm
Tyger42 wrote: Wed Jun 06, 2018 1:11 am 2) How little time in-story has actually passed. Flora's been pregnant for, what, nearly 10 years now real time?
We're coming up on 13 years since conception! The pregnancy is about to be a teenager :grin:
If things keep going at this rate. By the time Flora finally gives birth I should be getting grandchildren...
Elemental Templar wrote: Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:21 am To be a little more specific, she's at around two-months into her pregnancy as of page 1009 and to Finally put this thread at ease as to where Flora is, does anybody remember her dialog from this page?

We're probably gonna get a cut to her in the baths in a page or two, maybe even with Maren offering to groom her.

Which I can imagine being kinda awkward... But that's just my theory anyone else?
Yeah i kinda remembered she was in the first trimester or something. Wonder if we are gonna see the 9 or so months of process, or if Tom is gonna skip forward at some point. I kinda hope he does.

And yes i had forgotten about the shedding. That takes me to a theory, that her pregnancy is no normal hybridization affair thus the fur loss. Basically Blodborne's Arianna I really hope that is not the case thought...
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#52 Post by James Polymer »

Technic[Bot] wrote: Sun Jun 10, 2018 1:43 am Yeah i kinda remembered she was in the first trimester or something. Wonder if we are gonna see the 9 or so months of process, or if Tom is gonna skip forward at some point. I kinda hope he does.

And yes i had forgotten about the shedding. That takes me to a theory, that her pregnancy is no normal hybridization affair thus the fur loss. Basically Blodborne's Arianna I really hope that is not the case thought...
That's...good Lord, man. :shock:
That reminds me of the baby from Eraserhead, or that scene from Cronenberg's The Fly where Brundle splices two animals together. O_o
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#53 Post by Hulk10 »

I'm not so sure about that. It could be the result of her winter coat coming in. She even suggested that.
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#54 Post by Panther »

I would enjoy to learn more about Rose : she's captured young when she tries to visit Euchre at the magic school but Raine's mother frees her . Then she says , in the mansion , she was belonging to Saria . This puts a lot of questions :

How Rose has been caught again , and finished as Saria's slave ? If she has no collar , why she hasn't tried to fly away when Trace is become mad after Saria's death and begun to kill keidrans ? Rose's different eyes means she's under a mind control spell ?
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#55 Post by SpottedKitty »

Elemental Templar wrote: Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:21 am and to Finally put this thread at ease as to where Flora is, does anybody remember her dialog from this page?
Heh, I didn't notice before that Rose gave Flora enough of a fright to shed about a pound of fur all at once. :wink:
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#56 Post by MuonNeutrino »

Panther wrote: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:29 pmI would enjoy to learn more about Rose : she's captured young when she tries to visit Euchre at the magic school but Raine's mother frees her . Then she says , in the mansion , she was belonging to Saria . This puts a lot of questions :

How Rose has been caught again , and finished as Saria's slave ? If she has no collar , why she hasn't tried to fly away when Trace is become mad after Saria's death and begun to kill keidrans ? Rose's different eyes means she's under a mind control spell ?
We don't know that Rose was Saria's slave, or how exactly she got from where we last saw her in her original appearance to where she is now, but we do have some clues.

First, we don't actually know whether Mary freed Rose or not. While this comic might imply that, it's an april fools day comic so it's not canon. It does have the alt-text "No, but seriously, Rose ends up okay", and obviously she *does* end up ok, but there's nothing saying whether it happened in the specific way that non-canon comic described. (It *could* have happened that way, but it doesn't *have* to have.) And along those lines in particular, while the sketches are also non-canon unless stated otherwise, Tom's description for this color sketch certainly seems to be written (at least to me) as if he's intending it to be canon. At the very least, it doesn't contradict anything else we know, and seems to fit fairly well with the in-comic portrayals.

After that, Rose's next canon appearance is in the Dragon Masquerade side comic. Unfortunately, you can't read this one for free, but in short, Rose shows up again in the company of Saria. Notably, it's quite obvious that her and Saria are very close friends, and Rose is referred to as Saria's servant, but not as a slave (and is wearing regular clothing, rather than a slave's drab stuff, and no collar). Again, it seems to fit with the description of the sketch linked above.

Apart from that, of the other sketches that Rose has appeared in, a number of them also feature Saria in contexts that again seem to fit with the depiction in TDM and the above sketch of Rose as being both Saria's servant and close friend. Again, sketches aren't necessarily canon, but the theme seems to be pretty well established. Note again regular clothes all around, and no collar in any of those. Overall, if we take all of the above at face value, the picture seems to be of Rose having been rescued from a templar jail by Saria and having become Saria's servant and good friend, but NOT having been a slave. (Note that she still doesn't have a slave collar in the current comics either, and that she uses the word 'employed' to refer to her state, suggesting that she's not a slave now either. Personally I just put the appearance of her eyes down to her being old.)

This leaves the period between Saria's death and now as the major remaining unknown. The interesting question, of course, is how Rose ended up in somewhat of a position of authority under Grand Templar Trace, given that Trace did *not* seem to have been a person of importance at the time of Saria's death. After all, Rose was Saria's servant, not Trace's. Especially given Trace's attitudes, how did she end up working for him? The only real comic evidence we have for that period are Rose's statements in this comic, which aren't exactly a complete explanation of anything. If anything, they raise more questions - if Saria died before Trace came to power, how could she be the reason Rose is "still here"? After all, given that timeline this mansion wouldn't even have belonged to Trace at the time of Saria's death (given that Nora's narration here doesn't seem to imply that Trace was a duke yet), yet that line almost seems to imply that Rose had already been a feature of the mansion at that time.

If we didn't know better, that'd almost make me wonder whether Saria was actually from a noble family - specifically, whether she was the (only?) child of the *previous* duke of Edinmire. I've wondered a bit in the past how Trace managed to snag that position, and his having married into the line could have given a pretext for him to claim the title if the previous duke died sometime between Saria's death and Trace's rise to power, in addition to explaining how Rose could have been associated with the mansion even before Saria's death. Unfortunately for that theory, Saria's character page entry kinda nixes the idea of her having been nobility.

Absent interpreting that line of Rose's literally as her having been part of the mansion's staff already, one might interpret "still here" as "still with Trace". Which, of course, invites the question 'why?' What about Saria would have resulted in Rose staying employed by Trace and coming to such a position of authority and trust under him? The one thing I'd speculated before was that Trace may have kept Rose on due to her being a sort of piece of Saria to him, or something like that. It probably wouldn't have been instantly apparent just how twisted Trace had become, either, so perhaps Rose similarly stayed out of respect for Saria - to take care of the man she had loved. And later, once it had become obvious just how thoroughly off the deep end Trace had gone, it probably wouldn't have been particularly *safe* to rethink that choice. Under the circumstances, I doubt anyone could blame Rose for simply riding things out as best as she could. She's at least reasonably safe in a personal sense where she is, and she does seem to have at least a little practical power simply as Trace's proxy. If she cherishes any hopes of using that power, or whatever influence that her history with Saria might give her with Trace, to try to restrain his excesses, this is the only place she could do that.

I do hope we get some more time with Rose. The chapter title page seems to indicate that her and Raine will be spending some time together, at least, and one might hope that that would include Rose telling Raine her story. Right now, speculation is all we really have.
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#57 Post by Technic[Bot] »

James Polymer wrote: Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:58 am That's...good Lord, man. :shock:
That reminds me of the baby from Eraserhead, or that scene from Cronenberg's The Fly where Brundle splices two animals together. O_o
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Hulk10 wrote: Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:40 pm I'm not so sure about that. It could be the result of her winter coat coming in. She even suggested that.
Yeah probably not. At this point we are all aboard the "happy crossbred family" train and if it turned out that it was not Trace's child but some eldritch abomination Mask-demigod using Flora out of convenience. Well a lot of fans would be disappointed if not stright up heartbroken.
A less radical explanation would be that for "compatibility" Flora needed to be "more" human hence the shedding.
Panther wrote: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:29 pm I would enjoy to learn more about Rose : she's captured young when she tries to visit Euchre at the magic school but Raine's mother frees her . Then she says , in the mansion , she was belonging to Saria . This puts a lot of questions :

How Rose has been caught again , and finished as Saria's slave ? If she has no collar , why she hasn't tried to fly away when Trace is become mad after Saria's death and begun to kill keidrans ? Rose's different eyes means she's under a mind control spell ?
That is the 64,000 dollar question. How and why she came into Saria "possesion" ?
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#58 Post by Panther »

MuonNeutrino wrote: Mon Jun 11, 2018 3:22 amWe don't know that Rose was Saria's slave, or how exactly she got from where we last saw her in her original appearance to where she is now, but we do have some clues.

First, we don't actually know whether Mary freed Rose or not. While this comic might imply that, it's an april fools day comic so it's not canon. It does have the alt-text "No, but seriously, Rose ends up okay", and obviously she *does* end up ok, but there's nothing saying whether it happened in the specific way that non-canon comic described. (It *could* have happened that way, but it doesn't *have* to have.) And along those lines in particular, while the sketches are also non-canon unless stated otherwise, Tom's description for this color sketch certainly seems to be written (at least to me) as if he's intending it to be canon. At the very least, it doesn't contradict anything else we know, and seems to fit fairly well with the in-comic portrayals.

After that, Rose's next canon appearance is in the Dragon Masquerade side comic. Unfortunately, you can't read this one for free, but in short, Rose shows up again in the company of Saria. Notably, it's quite obvious that her and Saria are very close friends, and Rose is referred to as Saria's servant, but not as a slave (and is wearing regular clothing, rather than a slave's drab stuff, and no collar). Again, it seems to fit with the description of the sketch linked above.

Apart from that, of the other sketches that Rose has appeared in, a number of them also feature Saria in contexts that again seem to fit with the depiction in TDM and the above sketch of Rose as being both Saria's servant and close friend. Again, sketches aren't necessarily canon, but the theme seems to be pretty well established. Note again regular clothes all around, and no collar in any of those. Overall, if we take all of the above at face value, the picture seems to be of Rose having been rescued from a templar jail by Saria and having become Saria's servant and good friend, but NOT having been a slave. (Note that she still doesn't have a slave collar in the current comics either, and that she uses the word 'employed' to refer to her state, suggesting that she's not a slave now either. Personally I just put the appearance of her eyes down to her being old.)

This leaves the period between Saria's death and now as the major remaining unknown. The interesting question, of course, is how Rose ended up in somewhat of a position of authority under Grand Templar Trace, given that Trace did *not* seem to have been a person of importance at the time of Saria's death. After all, Rose was Saria's servant, not Trace's. Especially given Trace's attitudes, how did she end up working for him? The only real comic evidence we have for that period are Rose's statements in this comic, which aren't exactly a complete explanation of anything. If anything, they raise more questions - if Saria died before Trace came to power, how could she be the reason Rose is "still here"? After all, given that timeline this mansion wouldn't even have belonged to Trace at the time of Saria's death (given that Nora's narration here doesn't seem to imply that Trace was a duke yet), yet that line almost seems to imply that Rose had already been a feature of the mansion at that time.

If we didn't know better, that'd almost make me wonder whether Saria was actually from a noble family - specifically, whether she was the (only?) child of the *previous* duke of Edinmire. I've wondered a bit in the past how Trace managed to snag that position, and his having married into the line could have given a pretext for him to claim the title if the previous duke died sometime between Saria's death and Trace's rise to power, in addition to explaining how Rose could have been associated with the mansion even before Saria's death. Unfortunately for that theory, Saria's character page entry kinda nixes the idea of her having been nobility.

Absent interpreting that line of Rose's literally as her having been part of the mansion's staff already, one might interpret "still here" as "still with Trace". Which, of course, invites the question 'why?' What about Saria would have resulted in Rose staying employed by Trace and coming to such a position of authority and trust under him? The one thing I'd speculated before was that Trace may have kept Rose on due to her being a sort of piece of Saria to him, or something like that. It probably wouldn't have been instantly apparent just how twisted Trace had become, either, so perhaps Rose similarly stayed out of respect for Saria - to take care of the man she had loved. And later, once it had become obvious just how thoroughly off the deep end Trace had gone, it probably wouldn't have been particularly *safe* to rethink that choice. Under the circumstances, I doubt anyone could blame Rose for simply riding things out as best as she could. She's at least reasonably safe in a personal sense where she is, and she does seem to have at least a little practical power simply as Trace's proxy. If she cherishes any hopes of using that power, or whatever influence that her history with Saria might give her with Trace, to try to restrain his excesses, this is the only place she could do that.

I do hope we get some more time with Rose. The chapter title page seems to indicate that her and Raine will be spending some time together, at least, and one might hope that that would include Rose telling Raine her story. Right now, speculation is all we really have.
So yes , this strip https://www.patreon.com/posts/roses-rescue-15227270 should be seen as an unofficial canon about Rose fate . But one of the links in your comment leads me to put another question to my list : what common past Rose has with Natani ? http://twokinds.keenspot.com/comic/964/
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#59 Post by MuonNeutrino »

Panther wrote: Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:03 amSo yes , this strip https://www.patreon.com/posts/roses-rescue-15227270 should be seen as an unofficial canon about Rose fate . But one of the links in your comment leads me to put another question to my list : what common past Rose has with Natani ? http://twokinds.keenspot.com/comic/964/
Ah, yes, sorry, that's from another thing that happened in the Dragon Masquerade side comic. Long story short, Rose and Natani met briefly during the comic, when Rose fell afoul of Natani's infiltration of the titular masquerade. Not unreasonably, Rose seems to have been left with a rather suspicious view of the assassin and thief she was waylaid by. She's not afraid of Natani here in the mansion (even if she would be afraid at all, given her present tough-old-biddy persona), but she obviously considers Nat someone worth keeping her eyes on - and making sure Nat knows it.
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Re: Comic for Saturday, June 2nd, 2018: Sneaking Around

#60 Post by HerrIrish »

I have no profound insight about anything of these goings on, I just want to slip in that it should be "Why are his ears all floppy" and not "Why is his ears all floppy."

That is all.
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